Showing posts with label Orange County. Show all posts
Showing posts with label Orange County. Show all posts

Rick - Orange County 2012-14

Your Name

Rick

Gender

Male

Which describes your role at Mars Hill?

Regular Attender, Member, Group Leader (any leadership role)

What Mars Hill location(s) did you attend?

Orange County / Huntington Beach

What years were you involved / attending?

2012, 2013, 2014

How did you first hear about Mars Hill?

In 2011 my old church was going through a rough season, factions were fighting, and my dad found a sermon of this guy guest preaching at John Piper's church. This sermon was fiery, captivating, and frankly the best sermon I had ever heard. From then I began to podcast Mars Hill and Mark Driscoll.

What was the circumstance of your first time attending Mars HIll?

I moved to SoCal for college, when I heard there was a Mars Hill in Orange County I immediately started attending and got plugged in.

What were your first impressions?

I loved it, there have only been a few churches where I walked in and immediately felt like I belonged. I'm not cool or a hipster, but the atmosphere was awesome and I fell in love with the people of Mars Hill.

Why was Mars Hill your church home?

Because God made my community group my spiritual family. Because in community I finally understood grace and freedom in Christ. Because I believed God called me there.

What about your time at Mars Hill has had a positive impact on you?

I learned how impactful missional communities can be in a church. I learned how to take ownership of my church by serving. I learned that there are good and innovative ways to do church besides what I grew up with.

What about your time at Mars Hill has had a negative impact on you?

How Christianity failed me, how it failed Mars Hill. I believe all churches have shit, and all churches need to work through their shit when called out. What Christianity did was point to and yell about the shit they saw and condemned us. There were problems, and people only saw problems.
I am frankly bitter to this day towards Matt Chandler and Acts 29  because of how he handled his rebuke of Driscoll. Matt Chandler in his attempt to rebuke Driscoll gave the fuel to destroy Mars Hill. He "excommunicated" the whole church. His actions empowered the unloving critics and lead people like me to despair. He hurt me, he robbed me of my church family.
Chandler is not alone, in my view 90% of Christians condemned and rejected Mars Hill, Driscoll, and therefore me. There was little to no grace.

What would you like to have changed about Mars Hill?

1. Leadership structure.
I believe that the structure was put in place with good intentions. I think that as the church grew and leaders become more separated in distance and relationship decisions were slower and less united. Thus, centralizing leadership in the executive elders was meant to keep the church on mission, on task, and keep advancing the gospel.
This was a mistake. Centralized authority robbed the local elders of their ability to lead well, especially at Orange County. Centralized authority caused issues to never be fully addressed. Centralized authority caused distance between our leaders and the people of Mars Hill.
Authority should have been equal among elders. If size and distance made this a problem, maybe that meant we were too big or separated to be one church.
2. Women in leadership.
I believe women should be free and empowered to lead as God calls them. I am a complementarian who doesn't believe in female eldership or pastorship. But other than that, women are free to serve and lead throughout the church. Mark from the beginning emphasized men, which was refreshing to me, but this emphasis lead to women not being in significant leadership.
This impacted the culture in negative ways.
3. Share the pulpit.
Mark preached most of the time, but I think he should have shared the pulpit with other Mars Hill pastors on a regular basis. I think at least once a month. Guest preachers were great, but we needed to be taught and led by our local elders.
4. Less traveling for Driscoll.
At times it felt like we were facilitating Driscoll's Christian Rockstar status, rather than being served by him. Teaching is serving, but it felt like the people were incidental. I think he should and could have spent more time with the people of Mars Hill. Maybe that would have made him aware of issued before they became scandals.
5. Don't plant campuses out of state, plant churches.
I think the multi-site church concept is a great idea in a city or close region, like Seattle and the Puget Sound. But frankly, I never felt like I was in the same church as Everett or Bellevue. Mars Hill Orange County was not a part of the 'one church many locations'. We were a controlled church in the Mars Hill church network. They should have planted an independent church rather than have 1,000 miles between us and our "church family."
6. Less or no video teaching.
Let others preach, collaborate with the elders and let them preach.

Which describes you?

I stayed at Mars Hill through closure.

Please describe why you stayed at Mars Hill and what that experience was like.

Dustin Kensrue's letter was strong and resonated with me. One thing he wrote was to set a date to expect change, and if no change came, than you should consider leaving. This was in August 2014 for me. I prayed about it, and the Lord told me to see through the end of the year. As it turned out, that was how much longer the church had. Thus, I remained until the end.

How would you describe the reason for Mars Hill's closure to an outsider.

We were a church that grew aggressively, had problems, and were neck deep in controversy. For a long time we were led by the elders at the top of the food chain, and they made mistakes. When Driscoll stepped down and all the elders were allowed to make a decision they decided to separate into our own local church bodies to decide our future from there.
My location, Mars Hill OC, decided to close down rather than try to keep going. We had lost so many people, and our leaders were burned out.
So yes, Mars Hill is gone. But now there are many churches born from Mars Hill that still worship and proclaim Jesus. And that is a comforting thought.  

What's changed for you since your time at Mars Hill came to an end?

I was angry with my local elders for closing down Mars Hill OC for a while. But I've come to understand and move towards forgiveness in that.

Please write anything else you'd like to add.

I still miss Mars Hill. It was an amazing community to be a part of. I wish we could have worked through our shit rather than walking away from it. I learned a lot and grew a lot in my time there. I have no regrets about being a member there until the end.

Member - Orange County 2012-14

Gender

Female

Which describes your role at Mars Hill?

Member

What Mars Hill location(s) did you attend?

Orange County / Huntington Beach

What years were you involved / attending?

2012, 2013, 2014

How did you first hear about Mars Hill?

Husband listened to Driscoll's podcasts.

What was the circumstance of your first time attending Mars HIll?

Husband wanted to go hear the Real Marriage series and we were looking for a new church as newlyweds.

What were your first impressions?

Based on the podcasts, I didn't want to go.

Why was Mars Hill your church home?

Because my husband wanted it to be and I couldn't put my finger on a concrete reason why we shouldn't go there.  I just had a bad feeling about it so I gave it a chance.

What about your time at Mars Hill has had a positive impact on you?

We made a few "normal" friends.

What about your time at Mars Hill has had a negative impact on you?

Everything else.  The teaching being black and white with no gray area left our marriage with what felt like no grace.  When I disagreed with Driscoll's interpretation of scripture my husband would say things like "are you even a Christian?  You just don't agree because you don't want to follow that part of the Bible."   Sitting and listening to that teaching every week, I felt like I didn't fit in and something was wrong with me.  I started feeling like crap and judged.  

What would you like to have changed about Mars Hill?

Mark Driscoll out of leadership and the chauvinist attitude gone.

Which describes you?

I left Mars Hill prior to closure.

Please describe why you left Mars Hill and what that experience was like.

We left Mars Hill because of the way leadership was treating people.  We didn't experience all the things folks in Seattle did but our last community group leaders treated us pretty badly.  With the last straw being the husband who refused to make eye contact with me when I would talk to him and who would only look at my husband in defiance of me speaking as a woman.

How would you describe the reason for Mars Hill's closure to an outsider.

They f***ed themselves with their bullshit.

What's changed for you since your time at Mars Hill came to an end?

Different church, not trusting church, suspicious of people who are too black/white on beliefs, re-evaluating what I believe and what is actually true.

Rick Gutierrez 2011-14

Your Name

Rick Gutierrez

Gender

Male

Which describes your role at Mars Hill?

Regular Attender

What Mars Hill location(s) did you attend?

Orange County / Huntington Beach

What years were you involved / attending?

2011, 2012, 2013, 2014

How did you first hear about Mars Hill?

Heard about Mark Driscoll first, through videos shown at our church, and consequently discovered Mars Hill.

What was the circumstance of your first time attending Mars HIll?

My wife and I attended the first exploratory meetings for Mars Hill OC at a church in Irvine.

What were your first impressions?

Well-balanced with an excellent focus on community and mission. There was a strong impression that the leadership had everything together.

Why was Mars Hill your church home?

We (my wife and I) decided after much prayer and discussion to leave our current church to join the mission and take the opportunity to be in community close to our home.

What about your time at Mars Hill has had a positive impact on you?

There were times where we experienced love and prayerful support from many that we were in community with. We also experienced conviction through the preached word often.

What about your time at Mars Hill has had a negative impact on you?

It became quickly apparent through conversations with CG leaders that there was clearly a target demographic to be reached. It meant practically that our city (La Mirada) was only deemed worthy of attention because it was home to Biola University. We also slowly became aware of a lot of "branding". Things we'd taken to be impactful, were repeated so often as to become "mantras" or slogans.
As our family grew and our responsibilities increased outside of church, we felt kind of left behind, perhaps because we weren't contributing tangibly to the mission. While giving faithfully, church services never missed an opportunity to aggressively solicit more and greater contributions. We were also made to feel that cuts to newly hired staff who'd given up their other employment to serve the church were directly the result of our lack of generosity. When things started to unravel, our questions and concerns were turned on us, and when we persisted, our leaders seemed like they were being forced to deflect and divert us from those concerns by entreating us to trust those shepherds who were over us, though they also seemed confused and frustrated, even while toe-ing the party line. My wife and I waited and waited for someone in leadership to show some courageous support for people's concerns, but no one stepped out from under the umbrella. Also, we never heard what felt like a true, uncomfortable raw acknowledgement of the struggles that we the church were dealing with. Everything was so couched in soft, slippery language. It was so heartbreaking and frustrating.

What would you like to have changed about Mars Hill?

What's to be changed? Sadly repentance was never proclaimed, and very few if any took real responsibility for their actions and behavior. God saw fit to tear down a business pretending to be a "church-facilitating structure". God saw fit to expose abuse and misappropriation of tithes and offerings. He saw fit to expose pride and wordy ambition. He rescued those that are His from being led astray. I'm thankful for that. He taught me what it looks like when career is to be more valued than the gospel. By His grace, may I never find myself there.


Which describes you?

I left Mars Hill prior to closure.


Please describe why you left Mars Hill and what that experience was like.

Our experience was more of a gradual lack of enthusiasm for attending. The insistence that we sing our hearts out when there was such a heaviness attached to everything without a real acknowledging the validity of the heaviness. Yes, Jesus was and is bigger than those issues, but we did not experience any comfort from that truth. As many things were being revealed about the goings-on at the administrative level, our prayer was for leadership to repent and for God to be glorified through it. What better, more amazing way for God to be glorified than through the repentance of such influential leadership? Wouldn't we be willing to lose an empire AND the influence that comes with it in order to repent and bring glory to God? It became clear that it wasn't going to happen, though we never stopped praying for it. We knew we were done with Mars Hill though. We felt abandoned by our shepherds. We began to question our own understanding of what "church" should be. We'd been seeking "the right way" for so long, and had fallen short, perhaps by leaning on our own understanding, who knows. Now we just don't know anymore, and have grown weary with trying. We are no longer sure of much in the way of modern church culture, and are currently unaffiliated with any brick and mortar meeting.

How would you describe the reason for Mars Hill's closure to an outsider.
A dynamic personality with the ability to preach to a particular need in the culture found a niche that grew into an empire of modern church business. As ambition for more growth became the goal, the undergirding motives were exposed. God brought judgement on the people and practices that brought the name of Christ into disrepute.

What's changed for you since your time at Mars Hill came to an end?

Since we left Mars Hill, we've been very tentative about where to attend. We've resolved that we will find a church that serves our local community, where we can be truly involved in sharing life with one another. We're definitely trying not to be douchebags about our theological bent. We've been forced to acknowledge that many people who don't have the same understanding as us theologically are far more submitted to loving Christ and others. All I know right now is that I don't know much. I realize how trite that sounds, but it can't be more truly stated than that.

Please write anything else you'd like to add.

We are a bit fearful of being taken in by another dynamic personality or attractive system. I think we've learned that appearing to do everything so well as a "church" is no affirmation of its true affiliation with Christ. Things are broken. And people are broken. Life is broken until Jesus returns to make it new. Until then, perhaps we're given just enough to get by. Our sinful selves can't handle much more than that without screwing it up.

Group Leader - Orange County 2011-14

Gender

Male

Which describes your role at Mars Hill?

Group Leader (any leadership role)

What Mars Hill location(s) did you attend?

Orange County / Huntington Beach

What years were you involved / attending?

2011, 2012, 2013, 2014

How did you first hear about Mars Hill?

Listened to the Mars Hill podcast

What was the circumstance of your first time attending Mars HIll?

Looking for a new church

What were your first impressions?

I loved it. I have never felt so welcomed and loved. Not just by the love and kindness of others, but also because of how I was confronted about sin I was in from brothers in Christ.

Why was Mars Hill your church home?

God called me to be there

Which describes you?

I left Mars Hill prior to closure.

Please describe why you left Mars Hill and what that experience was like.

Too many questions, zero answers. Really a complete lack of communication or transparency

Please write anything else you'd like to add.

Here's a link to a blog post about my time at Mars Hill. Be blessed!
http://awakenosleeper.com/2014/12/31/my-time-at-mars-hill-church/