Regular Attender - West Seattle 2004-11

Gender

Female

Which describes your role at Mars Hill?

Regular Attender

What Mars Hill location(s) did you attend?

West Seattle

What years were you involved / attending?

2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011

How did you first hear about Mars Hill?

A friend of mine in graduate school was new to Seattle and had been shopping for a church in the area to attend. She settled on Mars Hill and recommended it to me.

What was the circumstance of your first time attending Mars HIll?

I was newly pregnant and my husband and I wanted a church to raise our family in. We were both raised in casually religious families but hadn't attended any church regularly since college.

What were your first impressions?

The church had recently opened the Ballard building and it was still mostly unfinished. It was huge, dark, and very trendy and modern inside.

Why was Mars Hill your church home?

It was the first church we had attended in years, and it felt progressive and interesting at first, so we were interested enough to stick around. As the years went on we met many wonderful people and formed deep friendships within the congregation. We felt challenged to grow in our relationship with Jesus and were captivated by Mark's passion in the pulpit.

What about your time at Mars Hill has had a positive impact on you?

The relationships we built within the congregation, especially with those in our community group.

What about your time at Mars Hill has had a negative impact on you?

The Song of Solomon and Real Marriage series nearly ruined our marriage. During SoS we were told that because we weren't having enough sex (according to the guidelines presented by Mark) and our sex life wasn't passionate and exciting enough (according to guidelines), we were in sin and not upholding biblical teachings on giving of our bodies to each other.

During RM we were bombarded by the book, the sermons, the community group video series and workbook, with the message being that our marriage was surely dysfunctional and both of us were to be confessing and repenting of our hidden sins. We were asked to do so in public during our CG, goaded on by our 24 year old CG leader. When we explained that we thought our marriage was functional and happy, and only had "minor" sins to confess to the group, we were labeled as being unwilling to allow Jesus into our lives.

It has taken years for us to recover from these accusations as well as from the damage they caused in our marriage. At the time we started to truly believe we were dysfunctional, because everyone said we were. We became suspicious of each other, wondering what the other was hiding that the rest of the church could surely see.

What would you like to have changed about Mars Hill?

I wish that the church had presented a wider variety of sources for understanding the gospel, whether through more pastors within the church or through encouraging the congregation to see Mark as a human whose interpretation was not necessarily Truth.

Which describes you?

I left Mars Hill prior to closure.

Please describe why you left Mars Hill and what that experience was like.

We left not long after the Real Marriage series, and after much prayer. As members, we were required to submit our separation from the church in writing and meet with our campus pastor. We lied about the reasons for our departure, saying we felt called to attend a church in our immediate neighborhood, because we were afraid of being accused of abandoning the church because we wanted to continue in our dysfunctional marriage. The campus pastor did not pressure us to stay, and wished us well at our new church.

The most painful part of leaving was wondering how our relationships within our CG would survive. I was afraid of losing the friends I left behind at MH and thought many would 'shun' me for daring to disagree with the church. In the end, only a few of those friendships were damaged at that time. Most remain strong even now. Some were strained further once MH disbanded and Mark was in the media for all his behavior.

How would you describe the reason for Mars Hill's closure to an outsider.

I felt that the church was no longer strengthening my relationship with Jesus the way it did when I first started attending. I felt that the church and the pastor had changed mission in a way I could no longer support.

What's changed for you since your time at Mars Hill came to an end?

My husband and I are now attending a new church in a denomination that was condemned by Mark during several sermons. We again feel challenged to grow in our relationship with Jesus and in our understanding of the gospel, and are actively serving in both our church and in community programs in our neighborhood. We feel free.

Angela Giboney 1997-2014

Your Name

Angela Giboney

Gender

Female

Which describes your role at Mars Hill?

Regular Attender, Member, Group Leader (any leadership role)

What Mars Hill location(s) did you attend?

Ballard, Bellevue, Downtown Seattle, Lake City / Wedgewood, Portland, Shoreline, Sammamish, Tacoma, West Seattle

What years were you involved / attending?

1997, 1998, 1999, 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012, 2013, 2014

How did you first hear about Mars Hill?

The person I was dating had played sports in high school with Mark. He told me about Mars Hill.

What was the circumstance of your first time attending Mars HIll?

It was at Laurel Hurst.

What were your first impressions?

Young, interesting, bible preaching, unusual music ever that sometimes was difficult to sing.

Why was Mars Hill your church home?

The people of Mars Hill loved and cared for me, I became a member and God made it clear it was home in this season.

What about your time at Mars Hill has had a positive impact on you?

God used the time at Mars Hill to move me from trusting Him with my eternity to trusting Him with my life.

What about your time at Mars Hill has had a negative impact on you?

Sadness that God's church was grown in way that included the pain of The body not giving the grace they have received and want to leaders when they sinned and were blind to their sin.

What would you like to have changed about Mars Hill?

Better communication and less fear.  More resources to children and a willingness to grow slower to ensure the people were not getting ahead of God's equipping.

Which describes you?

I stayed at Mars Hill through closure.

Please describe why you stayed at Mars Hill and what that experience was like.

God did not tell me to leave, so I stayed, so that I could be used for His glory where I was.

How would you describe the reason for Mars Hill's closure to an outsider.

Our church went through a difficult time and because of sin and fear that occurred over many years and the unforgiving response of some who claim to be Christians.  The plan for a long time was that if anything every happened to Mark the locations would each become different churches.  If Mark had stayed, the attention would have been on him, not on Jesus and for the safety and mental and physical protection of his children he could not continue in the same role.

What's changed for you since your time at Mars Hill came to an end?

It is hard to be excited about church to the degree we were before.  I have not yet heard from God where He wants me to declare membership.

Please write anything else you'd like to add.

God's church will continue to grow and many churches are being equipped with trained leaders for His glory, they are growing with people hungry for God and his word.  I wish God would have chosen a different solution, but God knows much better than I do what is necessary and best.

Member - Ballard, Bellevue, Shoreline, West Seattle 2005-13

Gender

Female

Which describes your role at Mars Hill?

Member

What Mars Hill location(s) did you attend?

Ballard, Bellevue, Shoreline, West Seattle

What years were you involved / attending?

2005, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012, 2013

Which describes you?

I left Mars Hill prior to closure.

Please describe why you left Mars Hill and what that experience was like.

We had a baby and it was a hard season of adjustment to get to church/community groups.  

What's changed for you since your time at Mars Hill came to an end?

Sadness for a broken family of believers

Please write anything else you'd like to add.

Other than feeling very sad for this church ending I wasn't part of the big upset.  Many are feeling grieved and emotionally hurt.  Perhaps my lack of involvement sheltered me from the pain?  I think that speaks more to my Lukewarm heart for the church, not necessarily my experience with MH directly. My heart goes out to those deeply hurting.  It will take a very long time to heal those emotional wounds.

Member - Ballard, Downtown Seattle, Rainier Valley, West Seattle 2000-13

Gender

Female

Which describes your role at Mars Hill?

Member, Group Leader (any leadership role)

What Mars Hill location(s) did you attend?

Ballard, Downtown Seattle, Rainier Valley, West Seattle

What years were you involved / attending?

2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012, 2013

How did you first hear about Mars Hill?

My boyfriend's coworker told him about MH, suggesting we may like it.

What was the circumstance of your first time attending Mars HIll?

I wasn't a believer but my boyfriend was. He asked me to go to church with him.

What were your first impressions?

People seemed genuinely friendly, not fake or super righteous. I enjoyed the sermon because I felt like I was really learning, not just about God, but history too.

Why was Mars Hill your church home?

We both felt it was the perfect combination of learning the Bible and how it's relevant to our lives in the present. Friendships were genuine and we appreciated the community.

What about your time at Mars Hill has had a positive impact on you?

See above.

What about your time at Mars Hill has had a negative impact on you?

Those friendships turned out to be not as genuine as we thought. As the church became multi campus, those friends soon became more invested in their new communities. It felt like we were friends out of convenience, so there was a sense of loss. Leadership became unapproachable which also contributed to that feeling.
The teaching from the pulpit permeated throughout community groups and staff and I became "lesser" as a female all across the board. The part of me that was strong and capable used to be valued and was appreciated in the leadership role I had. Then it became the very thing that was used against me because "I was preventing my husband from leading".

What would you like to have changed about Mars Hill?

Honesty.

Which describes you?

I left Mars Hill prior to closure.

Please describe why you left Mars Hill and what that experience was like.

I wanted to leave when Bent & Paul were fired but my husband wasn't ready. When we left in 3/13, we both felt called to go.
We left when the Result Source scandal surfaced, but there were compounding issues that led up to it as well.
Leadership became abusive in sin hunting and their actions/counsel devoid of grace.
When we left, all relationships ended.

How would you describe the reason for Mars Hill's closure to an outsider.

Pride and dishonesty in leadership.

What's changed for you since your time at Mars Hill came to an end?

We haven't been to church since, with the exception of a handful of times checking out different churches.
We nearly got divorced and are still feeling the repercussions of MH's teaching on marriage.

Please write anything else you'd like to add.

Mark Driscoll is a coward and I struggle not to hate him for what he's done. Displacing *thousands* of people from church is unconscionable.

Member - Ballard, Bellevue, Downtown Seattle, West Seattle 2000-14

Gender

Female

Which describes your role at Mars Hill?

Member, Group Leader (any leadership role)

What Mars Hill location(s) did you attend?

Ballard, Bellevue, Downtown Seattle, West Seattle

What years were you involved / attending?

2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012, 2013, 2014

How did you first hear about Mars Hill?

I first heard about Mars Hill from some friends at Seattle Pacific University that were attending at the time.

What was the circumstance of your first time attending Mars HIll?

My first Sunday at Mars Hill was in the Ballard building on Earl. I was new to the area, and looking for a church. I went with some friends from college and enjoyed the teaching.

What were your first impressions?

I thought the people were friendly and the teaching was honest. I enjoyed the preaching being from books of the bible, and the strong emphasis on the Scripture and it's authority.

Why was Mars Hill your church home?

Mars Hill was my church home because I felt at home there. I was growing my understanding of who God was, what His Word was about, and how to live according to it. I enjoyed the community and teaching better than other churches I had attended. It felt more transparent and honest, and less about emotional manipulation or fluff.

What about your time at Mars Hill has had a positive impact on you?

My time at Mars Hill was mostly positive. I learned much about the Scripture, about God, and about myself during my years at Mars Hill. The friendships that were made at Mars Hill were also positive. I was encouraged and supported well. I met my husband through those friendships. Overall, Mars Hill was a place of encouragement and growth.

What about your time at Mars Hill has had a negative impact on you?

The negative of Mars Hill came with its fast growth. As it grew and new policies were implemented, I felt like the policies started coming before caring for the people. The elders and staff also seemed too busy to shepherd the people and care for those hurting in the church body.

What would you like to have changed about Mars Hill?

Personally, I think Mars Hill would have been more effective if it had planted churches as it grew, instead of creating campus' and keep Mark as the main preaching pastor. Replicating the model of a healthy, smaller church through local church plants with their own elders would have been my suggestion looking back.

Which describes you?

I left Mars Hill prior to closure.

Please describe why you left Mars Hill and what that experience was like.

My heart left Mars Hill before I physically stopped attending. There was a mistrust that was growing and Bellevue specifically started feeling more like a production than a worship gathering. My motivation to attend regularly, combined with life experience just left us as irregular attenders that weren't involved in the community anymore. We slowly moved away and transitioned out.

How would you describe the reason for Mars Hill's closure to an outsider.

I would describe the reason for Mars Hill's closure as a result of poor management. As the church grew, the management of the church changed for the worse. I think the sin of the leadership, the culture of the church, and the overall structure was the reason behind the closure.

What's changed for you since your time at Mars Hill came to an end?

I have desired to be part of a smaller community where there is more transparency with leadership and finances. I want to be in a church where people and their needs outweigh policies.

Please write anything else you'd like to add.

Everyone who called Mars Hill home, or not, had a choice of continuing. We all have a conscience and convictions. In the past few years, and as the church closed I've heard so much blame on the church or specific leadership. While we have probably all been hurt by the sin of others, I found it frustrating that most people haven't taken responsibility for their own decision to stay or leave. When people use words like "spiritual abuse", I struggle to see that in my experience at Mars Hill. I don't feel like we were lied to or emotionally manipulated into anything through the teaching at Mars Hill. I wish more people had stood up against damaging policies, or refused to be overworked beyond what was right. Perhaps I just wasn't up high enough in the leadership to see the damage, but I still struggle to understand the blame of the church vs. responsibility of the individuals.

Jeff Bettger 1997-2014

Your Name

Jeff Bettger

Gender

Male

Which describes your role at Mars Hill?

Regular Attender, Member, Group Leader (any leadership role), Staff

What Mars Hill location(s) did you attend?

Ballard, Downtown Seattle, Shoreline, West Seattle

What years were you involved / attending?

1997, 1998, 1999, 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012, 2013, 2014

How did you first hear about Mars Hill?

I heard about it through some friends. A person I knew had led worship there early on once and I thought I would go check it out.

What was the circumstance of your first time attending Mars HIll?

I walked from my house in the u-district to its then Laurelhurst location. It was in the evening and they had candles burning and generally a dark atmosphere that I enjoyed.

What were your first impressions?

This is interesting. I think I could come back

Why was Mars Hill your church home?

I played punk rock music and watched horror films. Nobody at MHC questioned my Christianity because I enjoyed a darker aesthetic. I had always felt like a misfit. I was not "christian" enough for the Christians, and too "christian" for those who did not identify with Christianity. At MHC I found more people like me. I found a community of misfits who loved Jesus and also enjoyed the cultural stuff I did. The Philosophy and name Mars hill came from Acts 17 when Paul uses cultural icons of Athens to proclaim the Gospel message to the folks listening. I loved this idea and philosophy to faith in Christ.

What about your time at Mars Hill has had a positive impact on you?

There were so many different phases it's hard to boil down. Early on the fact that I was asked to be a part of the worship band was monumental. the Philosophy of writing a new song to the Lord was amazing. We created our own music and played it at church. that was saying a ton for cultural contextualization which I so loved. Later it was the friendships I established and some aspects of reformed theology really challenged my thinking. When Redemption Groups began I also had some intense life giving and changing experiences. The depths of intimacy, trust, vulnerability and love I felt present in that ministry was forever life changing.

What about your time at Mars Hill has had a negative impact on you?

The harping on gender roles had a negative effect on me. I did not see it then as much as I do now. It was an issue that was not a direct gospel thing it was a cultural agenda. I am not sure why Mark chose that issue to really harp on. I thought I did at the time, but I am not sure now.

My wife (high school sweetheart) never fit the MHC mold for relationships. Instead of being encouraged to be who god made us and build our life accordingly we tried to conform thinking it was God's will for us. Post MHC we have had a rough go figuring out how to readjust who we are with who we were taught to be. Jesus loves us and made us the way we are. We are now egalitarian and I am a feminist. The positive and theological depth of those issues was portrayed in a shallow one sided way at MHC. This had such a negative effect on me, that during that time I would use scripture to Lord over my wife, thinking I was justified in the eyes of God for Pharisaical self righteousness.

Another negative thing was the ideas that we were riding some wave of god's grace due to the numbers of people in attendance. This is not even a Biblical idea. the grace of God is for all people, and is in Christ alone. This large corporate branding and mega attendance stuff is confusing and another cultural thing that has nothing to do with the gospel. That was negative and has taken me a while to reorient my bearings back towards Christ instead of works.

I was in the first round of infamous layoffs. That was hard. It was also alienating. The way people were treated as commodity instead of family was negative. I wish that had been more apparent to me at the time. I would have left then. However I was duped by the confusing nature of pragmatism and numbers in attendance that I felt a part of something special. That was the lie. Being a part of the kingdom of God is what is special.

The result source campaign and the way it was told to me was a lie and therefore a false Gospel. I found out from some pastors and was alarmed so I took it through the chain of command at my location as I was a volunteer pastor as well. I was told that it was common business practice and therefore ethically alright. Shortly after I quit because I could not be a part of something that lied in the name of God, purposefully to make a platform for an author to get more money and popularity. That is a Gospel of self not of Jesus Christ.

I also raised support as a missionary in the city of Seattle. at first it was with MHC, but then it became more difficult to raise support in that environment. They wanted all the money to go to MHC not independent missionaries. I could not do that, and therefore I needed to leave so I could be in a healthy environment to do what I do.

What would you like to have changed about Mars Hill?

I would have not let MD have the authority he had. I would have made a plurality of elders and kept everyone with equal say. I would not have focused on high tech wizardry at the expense of knowing the congregation personally. I would wanted only the Gospel message preached with all of it's mystery and history of differences. I would have wanted RG's to be more of a focus with the values of gentleness, love, and waiting for God than some of the MHC heavy handed authoritarian hierarchic bologna.

Which describes you?

I left Mars Hill prior to closure.

Please describe why you left Mars Hill and what that experience was like.

I left because I was changing in conviction about how I wanted to practice my faith. I also was getting sick and disgusted by the lies being told by leadership. I was a pastor and sometime I would hear my fellow pastors answer honestly about things, but most of the time it was like everyone was part of a machine and spoke like they had no opinion of their own. When I found out about the result source campaign I was horrified. the last straw was seeing the advertising for the last resurgence conference and Marks last book. It felt like an us against them manifesto for culture wars. I wanted nothing to do with that kind of thing.

How would you describe the reason for Mars Hill's closure to an outsider.

I would describe it as God closing down an abusive, domineering, religious institution in order to soften the hearts of his people for others who live in the city around them. It is also a monumental example of how not to practice your faith. Do not think you are the best or even the right thing. There is a history of conservative and progressive Christians in this world. god is doing His thing among all people. We got arrogant and self righteous.

What's changed for you since your time at Mars Hill came to an end?

I still raise support as a missionary in the city of Seattle. The things I do have been easier and moved forward in a more well received light now that I am not associated with a religious institution hated by our city. I am a feminist and egalitarian now. I still have a deep profound faith in Christ.